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Question of the Week #28 (Completed)

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  • Question of the Week #28 (Completed)

    Answer our 'Question of the Week' for a chance to win prizes. This is a great way to participate in the forum so that we can get to know each other and learn about poker together.

    This weeks question is:

    How would you play this hand by 'xflixx'?

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  • #2
    I don't know certain details about the players that are involved in the hand (are they tight/loose/agressive/fish/etc.) is this micro/low/medium/high stakes so there will be different cases and I will explain how I would play in each of them,but first I will talk about the things that are not influenced by your table image (how other players see you -tight/lose/fish/etc.) or by your opponent's image.
    First of all you are the 3rd to act,an early-mid position,you have like 32 BBs and you open with QhJh.I got nothing against this play,especially if this is a turbo/hyper-turbo tournament where you have to be agressive,this so far is a standard play.The second thing I want to talk about is the sizing you chose to open with 276$ (around 2.3BBs) so I really really love this play,it's the amount of BBs I always choose to open with and here it's why:
    -you give yourself a chance to win the current pot (315$) by risking only 276$ pre-flop with a hand that is pretty good;
    -if the player in the BB is tight he will only call you with some strong hands,regardless of the sizing of your raise and if he is loose he will probably call you regardless of the sizing of your raise so it's pointless to make a 3/4BBs raise and you will probably end up playing against him in position with a hand that I guarantee it's going to be ahead most of the times pre-flop;
    -if you get 3-bet by a tight player you can safely fold and you don't lose that much,but if you open 3/4BBs and you get 3-bet and then you are forced to fold this is a bigger loss than 2.3BBs (think about it on the long run,if this happen 10 times you lose 23BBs instead of 30/40BBs).
    Now I have to talk about your range,the range is the amounts of hands you can possibly open with in that position.If this is a hand from a micro/low stakes tournament your range is not such an important fact to discuss about as micro/low stakes players just play really loose and don't pay that much attention to their opponents at the table,but anyway I will talk about the range as well.When you open in that early-mid position you are in,your range should be pretty strong,because in those early positions you should open with premium hands and decent hands (AK,AA,KK.....99,AQ,AJ,A10 suited,QK suited,QJ suited,depending on what tournament you are playing,turbo/hyper/normal,sorry if I missed a hand but I think you got my point) with QJ suited you have to know that you are at the bottom of your range (this is like the weakest hand in your range) so you are representing more than QJ suited,you should keep that in mind post flop.
    Okey so we go to the flop,you flopped bottom 2,the BB checks which is a pretty standard play and you chose to bet.I would bet 100% of the times in this spot,there are only big cards on the flop,which favors your range not the BBs' (as I mentioned before your range is pretty damn strong and your opponent in the BB has a pretty weak range,depending on how loose/tight he is and also because he didn't 3-bet you pre-flop) and by betting your protect your range.What I don't like it's the bet size you chose,you bet like 50% of the pot on the flop and I really don't like it,I would choose a smaller sizing like 30-40% of the pot and here is why:
    -as I'm going to bet 100% of the times on the flop if I get raised and forced to fold or get called and forced to check the turn I don't stand to lose that many chips and if your opponent missed the flop and you missed it as well,he will most likely fold if he is tight to almost any sizing that is bigger than 30% of the pot maybe even 25% of the pot;
    -there isn't that much value on this flop for your hand,your range is strong,your opponent's range is weak,most likely he missed and there are no draws on the flop only gutshots (Kx,10x),you are only getting value out of a weak ace which is probably going to fold against a bet on the turn,if your opponent is tight,and if your opponent is loose you are getting a lil' bit more value from some jacks,queens,kings,10s and furthermore if your opponet has a straight/slow played a big hand and now has a set and he chose to check-raise you on the flop his raising size will be smaller than the raising size he would choose if you would have made a 50% pot sized bet;
    -and the most important fact is that you are protecting your range;this means for the times you miss this flop,let's say when you have 99 (again at the bottom of your range) you can still represent an ace or even better.
    Now this guy raised you on the flop,3 times your bet and you chose to call.That's exactly what I would do because:
    -you are getting a great price;
    -if he is bluffing you just have to let him bluff;it's more likely he is bluffing as his range is weak and the best hands he could have are AJ/K10/AA(if he slow played)/QQ/JJ(if he slow played,but less likely as you got the Jh,Qh and you are blocking some of those combinations) which means he doesn't have that many value hands and he has more bluffs in his range,but this is a fact that is influenced by that player's image (tight/loose/etc.);
    -if he really has it then you are just calling to see if the turn helps you (a J/Q/heart);
    -there is no point in raising,calling will win you the most money on the long run if he is bluffing (as he might be bluffing the turn and the river as well) and make you loose less money on the long run when he has it.
    The turn brings the spade draw and this fella chose to check,which I don't really know why,he has the nuts,the flop is dry (doesn't have that many draws) and favors your range which means you most of the times will have at least an ace,also the spade brought a draw so he can get value from some combo draws like AsXs,QsJs,etc. as well,anyway he chose to check maybe to induce a play that didn't work well on the flop (trying to convince you that he bluffed you on the flop and gives up on the turn) and this depends so much on what type of player he is at what level he at,if he knows you only open with strong hands in that early-mid position,if you saw he is a good player,you should know that he has no reason to try to bluff on that flop that favors your range,not his and most likely he has you crushed and that's why he raised if he is a fish/donk most likely he is bluffing or getting out of line with a weak A and you have the best hand.Now you chose to go all in on the turn and I hate what you did,in that spot I would have checked because:
    -I mentioned before if he is a good player he knows that flop favors your range and he would only raise when he has a really strong hand so most likely you are drawing dead or thin,if he is a fish/donk you should still check as you are at the bottom of your range and there isn't that much value for your hand on the turn and even donks and fish hit strong hands on the flop sometimes and maybe he chose to play it really wired and also it's a tournament gaining chips is not as good as losing chips,trust me;so the most profitable play is to check and hope that you get to showdown.
    If you would have checked,the river would still be the same the 2d and if your opponent would have checked I would have:
    a) bet small like 30-40% of the pot (again there is not that much value for your hand and betting big might lose you more chips on the long run,for ex:you bet 50% of the pot he shoves you most likely are commited and forced to make a bad call) if he is a donky/fish,trying to get some value out of a Q/A;
    b)fold to a 50/50+% pot size bet if he is fish/donky/loose,as it's not worth risking that much in a tournament;
    c)fold if he shoves as I am not beating anything and if he is bluffing just let him bluff,it's not worth risking that much in a tournament as it is not a cash game and you can't rebuy (well in some tournaments you can,but I think you got my point);
    d)checked if he is tight and if he is checking;
    e)fold if he is tight and if he is betting.
    This is my analysis for this hand,sorry if I have misswritten anything !


    • #3
      Well...Unpleasant situation ,more commonly known as trap...We are in early position with suited jack queen...Blinds are 60-120 with 15 ante,we have around 32 big blinds , 3 bet "see bet" preflop seems a reasonable option...All fold till opponent at the big blind respect our raise and call...Flop came ,we hit two pairs with ace kicker on the table ...Big blind limp his straight with check...Half pot bet seems profitable option for us...It is followed by 3 bet re raise from our opponent! Here is the moment for thoughts and the earlier observation of the player 9...He have slightly bigger chip stack than our ,knowledge about his previous played hands and his style of play would give us some additional information about that re raise we involved in.Would we be profitable involving us into that call ? Options like our opponent hold AA,QQ or JJ leave us with the only hope of 2 hearts on turn and river for flush of hearts...AQ,AJ in the opponents hand take us as well ,as higher 2 pairs...Eventual K10 hand in player 9 give the opponent straight on the flop and the way he just called our 3 bet preflop seems reasonable for such an eventual hand he holds...If that is the case ,then we need desperately 2 of the 10 outs of hearts to show up on the turn and the river or at least 1 of our 6 outs jacks and qeens to show up on the turn or the river...Any other hand the opponent may hold we slightly dominate on flop stage, since he have 4 outs of 10s holding eventual king and waiting 1 sided straight draw or suited hand and waiting 2 more cards of same colour on the turn and the river...What are the odds of our opponent bluffing us with that check reraise on the flop ,trying to steal the not so big pot?(Knowledge about his performance at the earlier stage of the tournament-also known as "how he earned his current stack", could help us a lot at the current situation...Plus his play on the current hand show us he possibly play tight aggressive with only calling the preflop bet ,then check ,then reraising our 3bet on the flop,it is a sign of a caution!!!).Now is the moment to decide will we call the flop reraise,will we fold or may be reraise his reraise to gain a little bit more valuable information about his hand?The best play here by my opinion is to fold ,since we losing close to 1/4 of our stack and the game continues...More attacking and risky players could continue and double up from such a situation, hitting full house on the turn or river or even four of kind, if luck is what they possess... But most important part of the tournament play is to stay alive and not get busted and afford yourself to gamble if there is an option to survive the eventual circumstances and have chance to get back at later stage.Good Luck homeboys


      • #4
        I am a very rec player for a long time do not take my play as way to play but as way I would of played and lost .

        I most likely would of lost it all on flop . Pre flop I would raise 2.5 % ( I hate limping and min raise and want as many out of pot as possible with this hand. If SB did not fold there (my 1st hope) or if he raised enough to push me off (my 2nd hope given this flop ) . I am sure I would of ended up all in on flop . I am 2nd smallest stack to start with (depending on blinds but I think I am correct) . So let's assume SB given he is pretty much tied for chip lead here Just called to see a flop (what a flop it is . personally i would of folded in his position , out of position with a marginal hand against mid position raise ). So the bugger called it , post flop I see myself thinking I am ahead here (wrong ) and possibly he has not got a straight but AA or AA with a gut shot I think I want to push him off the hand to avoid the gut shot and him hitting a second pair on his weak A , SB checks I bet he 3 bets I 4 bet all in and of coarse he calls .Whalla I hope it is a re-buy . unlucky but hard to put him on the nuts there for me .There is a chance I make the turn I don't think it changes much other than he has a stronger A maybe 2 pairs so slight chance I fold here but really don't believe I got that far . There is a lot not known here so we make assumptions of it being early in tournament given stack size (this night save me as depending on buy ins and info known on villain I might consider it to early to go all in with the 11th best hand so IF a Freezeout I might fold (unlikely though ) and a re-buy I can't get them in fast enough , If it is cash game I I am a recreational player who loses a little have a few decent wins top prize was $3500 in a $5 buy in I play mostly micro stakes unless I satty into a good one . I am currently trying to move up as I was recently forced to early retirement and have a ton of time to study to get better


        • #5
          Not knowing anything about the players or development of the hand preflop makes it harder to guess but here is what i would do. With these cards preflop i would either rise 3 to 5 BB if i there are just limpers before me or i would pay previous raise up to 5 BB. On the flop having two pairs only big raise which would cost me more than 30% of my stack would be strong enough to make me fold this hand. In any case situation like this is very bad for player xflixx because such strong hand on the flop is very difficult to fold.


          • #6
            I like how Felix played its a setup hand....the big blinds check min raise does look strong but he shouldnt really have AQ and unlucky for Felix he just happened to run into the top of the big blinds range

            If the big blind was a nit/rock then maybe you can get away but with an SPR of 4 its unlikely


            • #7
              On the preflop I'd bet same way as xflixx did, after the flop seeing player 9 checking I'd also check to see what the turn brings + to see if player 9 was not slow playing me with some monster. Turn does not change much for me, therefore it would be crucial to see what player 9 does now, if he checks again then I'd play 2-bet or 3-bet to see his reaction. Assuming that he would do the same as he did in the hand (re-raise 3 times), I'd probably only call him suspecting that he hit the monster after the flop and is slow playing me. Once the river shows up it would be up to me to act first and here I would check just to see what player 9 does. At this stage he would probably bet at around half pot and myself after thinking for a moment would fold it. I have many bad experiences when I hit 2 average pairs on the flop - many times my oponents were beating me with higher 2 pairs or straight or trips...


              • #8
                for me , the preflop bets is good enough for the QJ suited then on the flop good too betting .i think turn is it better to check , likes what BB is doing , in that situation he/she cards is good because og Check and call .. i don't gamble with all-in in the River ...even i have 2 pairs because not so strong..


                • #9
                  Here's my take. Preflop the same. On the flop AQJr, I think this is really good flop for our overall range so we can bet it with most of our range, definitely with QJs, the sizing I'm not sure but if I had to guess anything between 33% and 60% is fine. I can also understand a bigger size bet but then again I would like to bet it with a lot of bluffs and thin value so smaller bet like 33-40% probably. When I get check-raised in this spot I don't think I have 3bets(Assuming i have no info on Villian). What I'm thinking before calling is V is probably having a really strong hand or some weird bluff, since this is not his board. KT is his best value and some AJ, AQ that he called pre. All of those hands have me crushed. Now what is he bluffing here, hard to say for certain but I would guess Kx or Tx hands may be the best bluffs. Maybe some pocket pair. If I re-raise here its pretty much allin and V is gonna fold all of his bluffs and call with the hands that crush me, so easy call I think. Turn V checks and honestly 3s doesnt change much also if V was bluffing with Spades he is most likely to continue on a spade. We have about one pot sized bet left so we can check the turn and bet the river or bluff catch. I will check this turn. Assuming we check and river is 2d, two scenarios: 1) V shoves 2) V checks. For 1) I will probably call, but I can see a case being made for a fold as well, it just depends on a lot of things, like am I beating this stake that much to not risk it in this spot? Villian reads? and many other small things. Now 2) is tricky because what calls my value bet, honestly its not much KQ? KJ? a pocket pair? is he even gonna call those, is he check-raising those on the flop? AX is the most obvious target but is he gonna check-raise a A on this flop. If we have information that he can do it with AX then easy bet. I just dont see a value bet without having any info.


                  • #10
                    Preflop standard.

                    Flop standard cbet + good size (if he was a fish,against reg optional sometimes to just check). And we get an x/r... Really don't think AQ or AJ ever have the opponent at this point,firstly because we blocking these,secondly he probably not just flatting these (well..maybe if he was a tight passive) so the only possible hand what beat us is a KT. Question is what we beating his range what he playing like this? Is he capable for x/r like pair + gutshots like KQ or QT KJ or KT,or maybe AT? Then here comes the other question,is he folding any of these if you 3betjam on the flop? Some turn card for us are not too good,and we could be in more trouble (8 card are giving an 1 card straight 3 card are messing our 2 pair) so if he not fold these,i'm happily jam the flop (and if he have KT then gg).

                    Turn is a blank. He decides to check again. At this point i don't get xflixx play. Still against the same range,but again if he's not fold on the flop these pair + GS,then why we are playing on the turn(and potentially letting him outdraw us?) Doesn't easier to just jam on flop? I'm checking,and on blank rivers i'm herocalling him,K, A, T, i'm folding it.
                    My backstory:

                    My diary:


                    • #11
                      I have watched this hand played about 100 times now...…………..

                      and I think I can honestly say...……….

                      well almost,

                      I don't think I would have played it any different,

                      So I think my answer is...…………….

                      I'm Playing it the Same

                      So yes I am losing this hand also

                      Cheers All
                      Poker Rule #1....Never listen to me...hiccup

                      7 Time Bracelet Winner


                      • #12
                        Hard hand to get away from but I feel I could lay it down sensing at times K 10 is and can be a common hand a lot of times.


                        • #13
                          First of all, I would like to say that there is no one right way to play the hand and we should play same hands and same hand strengths differently to keep our opponents guessing what we have. And it would be much easier with some information about players on the table. Are they tight or aggressive, loose or passive etc, how they played some hands, are they 3beting a lot or not etc. But generally, here are my thoughts about the hand.

                          Well lets start with preflop action.
                          This is questionable hand to play in early position, 6 players to act behind and is likely that someone is going to wake up with a big hand. I would generally raise that hand in MP and LP but mixing up the play is good. Another reason why this hand is problematic is that your opponent can easily hit the board harder than you do. If you hit top pair your opponent can easily have better kicker, even if the board is like this when you hit 2 bottom pairs your opponent could have better 2 pairs or a straight, its all in his range. The things you want to get with these kind of holdings are straights, 2 top pairs (your opponent could still hit some kind of set or maybe straights or flushes depends of board texture so you should still be careful and not overplay it), trips (it reduces the chance that your opponent has 4th Q or J with better kicker) and of course flushes (you should still be careful if you are not holding the nuts because there is some suited kings in opponents range and especially suited aces, and its dangerous if the board is paired so your opponent could have full house and win huge pot if you overvalue your hand)
                          I do not mind the raise, it depends of the player and how many hands he like to play but its much safer to fold
                          But we decided to raise, love about 2.3BB sizing, and BB defended
                          Board is A Q J rainbow which favours our range, we could have every set, lots of combos of 2 pairs, 2 bottom pairs is somewhere in the middle of our possible hand strength
                          Our opponent checks to us which is pretty standard and we decide to bet almost 50% of the pot. Really do not like the sizing here, would prefer somewhere around 35% so we could bluff the flop profitably even when we miss everything and in this case protect our hand from some combo draws and make them pay to try to improve. I would not mind going a little bit bigger if there was possible flush draw on the board, like 40% of the pot. 50% sizing is forcing away almost every worse hand out except some weak aces and pairs with gutshot draw like KQ, KJ, J10, Q10, these hands would want to see the turn but even them we would probably lose on the turn if we use 2nd barrel, we are almost never getting 3 streets of value here and we should keep that in mind. There are some reasons for possible check back and controlling size of the pot because his range has some hands that are drawing us pretty thin like AQ, AJ, K10, carefully played JJ, trapping with AA, and lots of his weaker holding we will lose if we bet here, while there is no many scare cards for us on the turn, A K and 10. And by checking we are giving the chance to our opponent to bluff the turn and possibly the river.
                          But like I said I would prefer C-betting here about 35% of the pot to protect from combo draws and weak aces which i think is big part of his range.
                          But we bet 50% and get check-raised. We are getting pretty good odds here, better than 3:1 so we should call. Unless our opponent is super tight, folding here would be too exploitative play. But generally, this is not the spot where players get out of line a lot because this board is crushing our range, and we should be hearing alarm bells in our head now, at best he has some kind of combo-draw I spoke about. It is highly unlikely that he is bluffing with pure air here.

                          Turn becomes a little bit strange, it is blank 3 which puts potential flush draw but it is not likely that are opponent has it, out of hands we are beating that could pick up flush draw there are only 2 combos, KQs and Q10s.
                          So the board did not change a lot but our opponent decides to check again and give up the betting lead, which is strange play because the board is almost the same, if we called him on the flop we are probably going to do it again, and the board should be crushing our range more than his so we have many hands we are probably calling him.
                          That probably thought xflixx too during this hand so he decided to go all in to protect from some kind of draws or to try to get a hero call from weak ace.
                          But I do not think this is good play, we should choose to check back because we are rarely getting paid by weaker holdings, and we are giving ourselves chance to re evaluate on the river, not really many reasons to try to protect our hand here.

                          If we checked back, the river would be 2, again unlikely that anyone improved.
                          1) If our opponent checks, we should think about how often he is trapping with monster here and by which weaker holding we are getting called, I do not think he has a lot of check-calling range, maybe some weak ace hero call, if we have a soul read on him that he has just a pair of aces I would bet around 35% of the pot to try to get call but mostly I think check is good here. If he was (semi)bluffing we win, if he was value betting we lose.
                          2) If he goes all in, it is tough spot, without any information about our opponent I would be more inclined to fold because it does not seem like the line someone would be taking like the bluff specially we could be holding every big hand, pair of aces or queens he would probably try to get to the cheap showdown, so its either bluff or a monster, and he does not have many bluffs here.
                          3) If he bets small, my thoughts are still the same, just now we are getting better odds to call and risking less of our stack, that sizing would make me suspicious, even though it seem valuing a lot when player bets small in this spot would not have much sense, because like I said out range has many good hands, if he is value betting he is probably getting called even if he goes all in because we just have pot size bet behind. But I still think this is the board he would not bluff a lot so I would be more inclined to folding. In long run I would mix up about 30% of calling just because sizing here is suspicious.

                          This is my analysis of the hand, hope you enjoy it
                          Good luck to all!


                          • #14

                            xflixx is in early/mid position with one of the shortest stacks on the table. There are antes and so his stack is equivalent to about 16 BB without antes. There are 2 players behind him with much larger stacks, one with the shortest stack and both blinds have medium stacks.


                            IMO this hand should be folded preflop from this position. With xflixx’s stack size he should be loosening his opening range a little, but avoiding playing hands that are dependent on implied odds such as suited connectors. The hand is easily dominated and there is considerable risk of a re-raise from both the big stacks and the smallest stack behind. Then he will be left with a very difficult choice and probably has to fold. Whilst the cards are both broadway I don’t think they are strong enough to open.

                            Having decided to play the bet size is too small. If everyone folds then it is true the blinds have been taken with very little risk. However the BB’s smallish stack size indicates that he also should be loosening his range and the price he is offered to call is too good to fold a very wide range. He only has to put in 146 into a pot of 747 which requires < 20% equity. Villain has a lot of implied odds and can call with Ax, Kx, other suited connectors, medium and small pairs. There should have been more pressure on the villain with a raise to 450 or 500 so that villain has to call with a significant % of his stack. But this is too much money to risk with this hand confirming the view that it should be folded.


                            This hand should have been bet postflop but then folded to the check raise. The board texture is quite wet but has hit xflixx with bottom 2 pair and a backdoor flush draw. Villain checks OOP.

                            At this point xflixx will have assessed that villain’s range is unlikely to include big pairs, AK, AQs as these would have been raised pre-flop. But villains range is still very wide and is not narrowed by the check back.

                            xflixx also knows that his own range is likely to consist of high cards, high pairs or otherwise and so to villain this flop looks to have hit xflixx better than villain’s range.

                            Xflixx should bet here hoping to catch villain with worse hands such as Ax, AT, KJ, KQ, T9, K9, as each of these only have a few outs to improve. The only hands that xflixx fears are AJ, KT.

                            Since the board has hit xflixx’s range better than villain’s range the bet does not have to be big. xflixx’s ½ pot bet is perfect to make any draws pay but encourage calls from villains weaker hands.

                            The CR by villain has to be seen in the context of the strength of xflixx’s range. Villain must know that xflixx has a strong hand and so the CR must be super strong. It is a close decision as to whether xflixx should call, re-raise or fold. Re-raising means he is only being called by the hands he most fears so should be discounted. He has the pot odds to call if he can assume that all the chips are going in the middle should he hit the Q or J. However, so far he has only committed about 20% of his starting stack and whilst xflixx may worry about his table image by folding he has to assume he is behind in this hand and graciously fold to preserve his remaining chips for a better spot.


                            xflixx should check the turn and wait until the river to decide whether to make this bet should villain check the river or the Q or J comes.

                            Villain’s check on the turn looks very suspicious. Villains range looks super strong so why would he check the turn. He must be trying to make his range look weaker than it is, perhaps bringing hands like T9 or bluffs into his range. However, he is unlikely to play these hands with a CR on the flop when he knows xflixx is likely to have hit the board hard.

                            xflixx is either ahead of these hands or is a long way behind and so he should check back, hoping to get to the river showdown and maybe catch a Q or J on the way. He can save this bet for the river should villain check again.


                            • #15
                              Total chips put in by xflixx suggests he has somewhere from 3-4 thousand chips left. Tournament stage might be close to mid stages or beginning mid stages but I think what xflixx was trying to do here is grow his stack. Would have played the hand the same way except to the point where he calls the reraise (ofcourse this eventually depends if big stack is betting a lot more than he should) but calling the reraise of big stack was the making of an all in binary situation. I know sometimes players bluff but I don´t assume them all to be stupid. Anyway, i really enjoy watching during the little available time I have xflixx playing or explaining things. He looks like a fun witty guy to converse with.



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