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All in question.

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  • All in question.

    First of all this is my first time I use the forum so I am sorry if this is not the right place to post it. I use this website everyday and I really thank all of you guys for all the info you give us and the help of course!

    So this happened to me last week...

    Cash game online, blinds 2/5c stack is around 14dollars from the initial 4dollars.

    A very tight opponent raises x4 from middle position and a guy from the button call and thus from the BB I call as well with 2 5 of spades...

    Player A had around 12dollars and Player B has around 6dollars...

    Flop comes 5D, 4S, 10S... ( I have a very small flush draw and a pair) I check and Player A bets 3/4the pot, Player B folds.

    Turn comes 3D and now I add an open straight draw too... Player A bets the pot this time and I reraise him x3 and he shoves all in...

    Since the nature of the Player A is to play nearly only the premium hands like that I put him on AA, KK or QQ at this stage. If AA he has some of my outs away.

    Now I thought I had invested enough and with such a huge draw I had to call so I called and as many times happens the river was a blank 8D !!! And he had QQ

    Question is this... Should I have reraised him and/or called an all in so deep?

    I thank you all for the answer and wish you the best of luck for this new year. ( Hope I posted in the right place! )

    Etienne
    Last edited by etipac; Mon Jan 02, 2012, 07:18 PM. Reason: missing info

  • #2
    a little difficult to vizualize without amounts but i'm sure i'm folding or maybe calling, never raising or calling a shove.
    17 Time Bracelet Winner

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    • #3
      *** moved to more appropriate forum since cash game hand question JWK24***
      Super-Moderator



      6 Time Bracelet Winner


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      • #4
        preflop: 25 spades when you have a player that you know is only playing premium hands should be a fold. Even if you hit a pair, you're behind, so caling their bet here (even from the blinds) is something that you wouldn't want to do. If the opp was playing a wide range, then you can try to make a case for caling, but not against an opp only playing premium hands.. calling then is too loose.

        flop: you get 2nd pair and a flush draw. The opp's bet here of 3/4 pot prices you in, so I'm calling. You have 9 outs for the flush, 2 outs for trips, 3 outs to two pair.. for 14 outs (52% equity).

        turn: you get more outs with the straight draw. You now have 20 outs (the original 14, plus 6 from the OESD). That means you have 40% equity here and you don't want to make/call a bet over that... because then it's a -EV play for you. When the opp makes a pot size bet, you will have 1/3 invested in the pot if you call (33%). Due to this (40% equity vs 33% pot), you should just call their bet here. You don't want to be raising or calling their shove without a made hand. You're going to miss your draws 60% of the time.
        The best play here is to call and re-evaluate on the river. If you hit the river, then bet, if not, then fold.
        Super-Moderator



        6 Time Bracelet Winner


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        • #5
          Numbers...

          So On the flop he bets 3/4 pot so 30c ( pot is 42c). Other player folds and ,I call and pot is now 1.02$

          Player A had around 12$ and I had 14$ before we started the hand.

          Turn: I check he bets the pot so 1$ and I reraised for 3$ and player shoves all in.

          Hope it helps.

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          • #6
            many outs have to be discounted, imo,and whatever hands he makes he can never have the nuts, he might be drawing dead already.

            ps: to me it's probably a fold on all streets.
            Last edited by Django66; Mon Jan 02, 2012, 07:51 PM.
            17 Time Bracelet Winner

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            • #7
              I thank you for your replies, I believe I did 3mistakes there. Calling with the 25 from the blinds, reraising him and calling his shove!

              Etienne

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              • #8
                Hi Etienne,

                Welcome to the forum! In the future it is helpful if you retain the hand history from pokerstars to post, which can be done via the replayer to provide a visual along with precise stack sizes, actions, etc.

                I also wouldn't call 25s out of position preflop very often here... granted we are quite deep with the raiser but him being very tight (nitty) it will be tough to extract value from this guy when we hit and also tougher to make effective moves than when in position. I would actually much rather be playing this from the button than the blind simply due to the positional advantage (and against very tight players who are 280 bb's deep effective we can put a lot of pressure on them post flop so we can call in position with a pretty wide range and make the tight player's life miserable on board textures that will be scary to his tight range).

                As played, I would not check-raise him on the turn personally. This is a very strong move against an opponent who's range is weak, or one who is overly cautious. In this case though the way he has played his hand (double barreling big sized bets) it is pretty much face up as a premium pair. Most TAG's at microstakes just aren't capable of folding a big overpair to the board unless the board is extremely scary looking (like 4 to a straight, or 3 to a flush, minimum). They just aren't, which is what makes them so beatable. The way to beat them though is to build the huge pot when you can beat their premium pair and they will overplay it. In this case you have enough outs that you can call, but semi-bluffing when there is no "bluff component" (since his range is very premium pair heavy and he won't fold those) essentially is just going to end up charging yourself to draw at him.

                So once we see this flop my generally preferred line would be check/call flop, check/call turn, bet river if I improve, check-fold if I don't.
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                4 Time Bracelet Winner



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