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AA Vs 88

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  • AA Vs 88

    Hello All, I recently played this hand against a very aggressive player. Gosh I was scared playing this hand. Although I won the pot but I am still confused if I played it right. Should I play it the same way in future? And if my evaluation was correct - it does seem like it, as I won the pot, but man was I scared calling his shove. KingsChUbI aka Villain - I have no history with this player, however, I had been on the tables for about 30 hands, so his stats looked like - 23/23 Agg 100, F3B 50, cBet 67 - so a moderately tight player - so far he his 3B 0 | wtS 50 | WaS 0 | Wws 50 & his ATS (Attempt to Steal is 43%) & flops seen 13% my image on the table so far has been very tight as well. I haven't played a lot of pots. To be precise, none from the SB yet. I pickup AA in SB. Villain being the button does his standard 3x raise, I re-pop it - he calls. Pot is now 4.75 - since I am first to act I bet the pot. Although fairly coordinated for the one playing 77, 44, 56, 56s or an over pair to the board - however, since he called my 4x, I can eliminate 44, 56o or 56s - considering he seemed like a tight player from his stats so far. Nonetheless, he flats me. Tc comes off and now I am thinking may be he has 77, as he called my pot size raise. I do not put him on a flush or TT - as of now I am thinking may be he made trips from pocket 77 or he has QQ JJ etc. So I bet the pot again. and he moves ALL IN & I call, unfortunately, the action went so fast that I did not calculate my pot odds for this call, although I did pause for a second, as all my previous hands where I have lost money, the hand had played out the same way. Specially against TRIPS - from my history of Poker I have lost most money against SETs so far and I have analyses my play and the play of my opponents who have played this way. But I decide to call and he shows 88. So because of my previous history against SETs I was so scared to make this call. How can I tackle it in future. I will post some of my lost hands against SETs soon to get them analysed by you guys. Any feedback is appreciated and thanks in advance. cheers

  • #2
    Dont eliminate small pairs so quickly when building his range,players love to set mine and I see a lot of regs that only seem to be at the table for that alone.

    You say you didnt slow down to think,which is another reason he might see his 88 as good.
    Sometimes I have been able to pick up that a player is basing a lot of his action off my timing tells.
    I would say that he was duped by your fast play and put you on a bluff. I note those situations and use them later on for bluff situations.

    So I have no issue with you getting to the river but I do have questions about your bet sizing on the flop and turn.

    Are you always betting 95% of pot? I think if you are always betting this amount you are missing
    spots where you could lead a player with your bet sizing.

    For example:

    You bet 75% of pot on flop against a floater and tank a bit on the turn and throw out a 25-30% bet
    and he overreacts to it and shoves because he is so excited a tell can be exploited.
    For some reason I have a hard time picturing you betting that amount every hand you are in,so
    that is why I question it.

    As for tackling your fears,it comes down to paying dues at that lvl you play to find out who the regs are and how they like to play. Some regs I fold to when they decide to wake up and play
    once every 30 or so hands. Looking at my tracker I can see they tend to be able to out play me and its better to let them set mine some one else. I have no problem doing that if I am not feeling like getting into a reg war of some kind or feel like my roll isnt quite right to open up.

    Trips is always on my mind as well,but you watch the players range and you can start narrowing them down pretty good. 300 hands or so and you should have a good starting ground for that player.


    • #3
      Thank You Iseecookies

      That was great advice. I think you picked up my weaknesses.

      1) Yes, I do not bet pots for all my hands. In this hand I did it cos I wanted him to fold ASAP, I was scared myself.
      2) I am still learning to optimise my bet sizes.
      3) Your tips to finding out the regular set miners is something I am going to seriously consider.

      Thank you once again.


      • #4
        Frankly , I wish I had your problems how to play AA . It has and will be beat in the future .
        Never consider to bluff ? If you havnt , then you never win anything .


        • #5
          I really fail to see why you'd be "scared" about making the call of the jam when you are getting about 3.4 to 1 to call ($56.12 in the pot, versus a call of $16.79).
          Those odds mean you really only have to be "right" that your AA is good about 23% of the time to break even on a call.

          If you consider:
          A) No likely straight hands would be held by the villain after you 3Bet pre flop
          B) No likely DRAWS got there on the turn when the villain shoved
          C) No likely hands that would have spiked 2 pair would have called your pre-flop 3Bet (not with a 23% VPiP and 50% fold to 3bet rate)
          D) No likely AT/KT hand would have stuck around after your near pot bet on the flop
          E) At least some of the time the opponent will be bluffing

          Then the only likely hands for the villain here are sets, and lesser board over pair hands than your AA.
          Amonsgt the most likely holdings, there is EASILY better than a 23% chance he is on a weaker hand than your AA, especially when you consdier the 33/44 hands are going to have a bit of a hard time calling your 3Bet pre-flop.

          The fact is, if you are going to fear to pull the trigger on that turn re-raise in a pot this size, you really should NOT have bet as much as you did to build the pot to that size in the first place. Actually though, if you "read" the villain as one who loves the float play pressure move (a case you can make with his HUD data, albeit it is a small sample), then I really like the fact you built the pot early to make your decisions easier.

          The HUD data you have indicates to me a player style who likes to "play for pairs". By this I mean he likes to raise a lot upon entry, then relies on the "power" of his raises to limit the number of opponents, which then makes it easier to exert pressure to take down the pot before showdown. His lack of 3bets ties in with this type as well, as a lot of float palys can be made from position with this style.

          His 23% VPiP at a 6 max table is not what I'd call "tight", but it is not extremely loose either; I think I'd characterize it as "opportunistic". that could well mean he is using position to widen his range, and seek out ways to exert pressure on opponents he views as too loose or too tight. Versus this type of player, especially one whose particular "leak" is that he fails to account for potential feelings of pot committment (which you had every right to feel after your 2 large bets), makes your larger flop and turn lead bets all the more profitable.

          A Player of this type would "expect" you to FOLD if you had simply been firing 2 bullets with un-paired bigs, and would also expect you to fold here at least some of the time if you held a hand like JJ or even QQ (in fear that HE held AA/KK or the set). His 88 has enough value that he may convince himself that your big bets do not mean the "strength" you are making them with, but instead mean "fear" for un-paired over card type hands. If you used those level thoughts to out hink him, then you did very well in the hand.

          But next time, if you DO feel "fear" that you may have run into a set, do NOT seek to rush big bets into the pot...they will only cost you MORE if you are right in your fears. Instead you should adopt a pot control line EARLIER, like by checking the turn agaisnt a palyer who may not seek to rucsh a large amount of chips in on something other than a very strong made hand; you can feel confident in calling those types of bets with an over pair. Your AA benefits from playing a bigger pot earlier in the hand, by making a bluff try less likely because any bluff lays you good pot odds to call...and even if you are "wrong" you have had enough reason to get the money in that you did, so that additional loss is really not large huge.

          (That is compared to keeping the pot around $10, checking the turn, THEN seeing an $8 bet you call, thus making it possible for the villain to stack thru you on the river...see?)

          By the same token though, living in fear of sets is not a thing to do a lot. That is being scared of monsters under the bed when you hold a hand like AA.
          Last edited by JDean; Thu Oct 06, 2011, 08:01 AM.
          Double Bracelet Winner


          • #6
            Originally posted by JDean View Post
            By the same token though, living in fear of sets is not a thing to do a lot. That is being scared of monsters under the bed when you hold a hand like AA.
            I love it!



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