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I would like an explanation

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  • I would like an explanation

    This hand I feel requires some kind of explanation. I can understand folding if you think you are beat, but for the sake of SIX chips ? Even if the bet was a total bluff, there can be no reason for this action, excepting maybe Collusion. PokerStars Game #66071320091: Tournament #416802186, $0.50+$0.05 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level IX (200/400) - 2011/08/15 20:28:34 ET Table '416802186 1' 9-max Seat #4 is the button Seat 1: greycowboy (6255 in chips) Seat 2: AusYabby (6207 in chips) Seat 4: awesomo3012 (15736 in chips) Seat 6: Bill Curran (736 in chips) Seat 8: Prince Dale (2856 in chips) greycowboy: posts the ante 50 AusYabby: posts the ante 50 awesomo3012: posts the ante 50 Bill Curran: posts the ante 50 Prince Dale: posts the ante 50 Bill Curran: posts small blind 200 Prince Dale: posts big blind 400 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to Bill Curran [2d 8s] greycowboy: calls 400 AusYabby: folds awesomo3012: folds Bill Curran: folds Prince Dale: checks *** FLOP *** [7c Tc Ah] Prince Dale: checks greycowboy: bets 1200 Prince Dale: calls 1200 *** TURN *** [7c Tc Ah] [Th] Prince Dale: checks greycowboy: checks *** RIVER *** [7c Tc Ah Th] [Ad] Prince Dale: checks greycowboy: bets 1200 Prince Dale: raises 6 to 1206 and is all-in greycowboy: folds Uncalled bet (6) returned to Prince Dale Prince Dale collected 6050 from pot Prince Dale: doesn't show hand *** SUMMARY *** Total pot 6050 | Rake 0 Board [7c Tc Ah Th Ad] Seat 1: greycowboy folded on the River Seat 2: AusYabby folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 4: awesomo3012 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 6: Bill Curran (small blind) folded before Flop Seat 8: Prince Dale (big blind) collected (6050)
    3 Time Bracelet Winner

  • #2
    Perhaps a missed club draw or counterfeited pair of 7's he turned into a bluff but did not want to showdown.


    • #3
      if thats not a chip dump I dont know what is....raise it up to within 6 chips then fold? come on... busted draw my rrrrrrrss


      • #4
        Since this was for money, PLEASE send it to support and mention chip dumping They are both from the same country, so very good possibility umbup:


        • #5
          Originally posted by Sandtrap777 View Post
          Since this was for money, PLEASE send it to support and mention chip dumping They are both from the same country, so very good possibility umbup:
          umbup:+1 Please send immediately to PS support.

          6 Time Bracelet Winner


          • #6
            report it.

            I'd call that last 6 chips there and play board if I had to.
            Double Bracelet Winner


            • #7
              bump needs more love imo.


              • #8
                lol i love these guys in the hand its hillarious


                • #9
                  Originally posted by JWK24 View Post
                  umbup:+1 Please send immediately to PS support.
                  Was sent about two minutes after the hand was played. Support said an investigation was started, could take two weeks.
                  3 Time Bracelet Winner


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Bill Curran View Post
                    Was sent about two minutes after the hand was played.

                    Support said an investigation was started, could take two weeks.
                    By the way bill...

                    How is Queen Lillybet, and the heaving mass of bubble and squeek?
                    Double Bracelet Winner


                    • #11
                      well what happened??


                      • #12
                        YES I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT HAPPENED
                        STONE BLUFF THAT GOT CALLED ?
                        MISS CLICK ??

                        sometimes i laugh so hard tears run down my leg


                        • #13

                          sometimes i laugh so hard tears run down my leg


                          • #14
                            This is the E.mail I got from PokerStars Security regarding this matter.

                            I had to retype the message, as for some reason I don't seem able to copy and paste from my E.mail provider.

                            I hope that re-posting this in the Forum does not infringe any of the Rules ?

                            If it does, Joe or Brian please delete.

                            Hello William,

                            Thank you for your report.

                            PokerStars continually monitors the games for collusion, and we sincerely appreciate you bringing your concerns to our attention. Following your report, we have completed an investigation into the accounts of players 'greycowboy' and 'Prince Dale'.

                            One of the most important aspects of a case we consider when reviewing a case for collusion is whether or not the suspect players have a relationship. Key in trying to determine the nature of a relationship, if any, is location. In this case, one player lives in Newcastle-upon-Tyne, and the other Broxbourne, Location, however, is generally not a good indicator as to whether cooperative play is occurring or not. It is noteworthy, but in and of itself is not sufficient.

                            Aside from location, we use a variety of tools and methods to assist us in determining whether or not relationships exist between players. One of the things we look at is their frequency of play together. Given how many players are playing on PokerStars at any given time, it would be unusual for seemingly unrelated players to frequently end up at the same table. The players in this case have only played 7 of their tournaments together. This fact, along with the other data we considered, confirm that these players do not seem to have a relationship with one another.

                            No collusion review could be complete, though, without a thorough review of the play itself. An advantage of online poker, as compared to live poker, is that every hand is recorded, allowing for a complete review. If any play is considered suspicious we can review the hands with all cards showing.

                            When reviewing tournament play for possible collusion we check for the following:

                            1) Best hand playing - where colluding players play only the better of their two hands.

                            2) Soft playing - where colluding players refuse to play aggressively against each other. For example they may check or fold against each other where they would normally bet or raise against a stranger.

                            3) Chip dumping/Stack balancing - where the large stack folds to the small stack to balance their chips. The idea is to improve the chances of both players finishing in money positions in a tournament.

                            We found no evidence of any of this suspicious play. I have located the hand you have referred to and attached it below:

                            (SEE POST #1 FOR THE HAND HISTORY)

                            I agree that this hand looks unusual however, we can't conclude that these players were colluding from this one and only isolated occurrence. Whilst we can't say for certain why the player folded here we can definitley provide you with a few possibilities. Please consider the following:

                            1) It was a miss-click. We have some of the best multi-tablers on our site constantly making such mistakes, they are very common and the price that many multi-tablers pay for playing in a large number of events at the same time. Another reason for miss-clicking could be that they were doing something else on their computer in the background such as downloading some music or browsing the Internet which could have caused them to take the wrong action when the table popped up. Please understand that be it online or live, all poker players regardless of their skill level have made the wrong fold (or call) at some point throughout their poker career.

                            2) It is possible that this player, not aware of the small number of chips their opponent had moved all-in with, based their decision only on their own cards. In such situations it is certainly possible that some players, even those playing large stacks, play incorrectly, considering only their own hands, and not properly weighing their opponents' chip count.

                            3) The player could not justify calling any size bet given the weak hand they held. Calling may have seemed meaningless as they were fairly confident they were not going to win the hand no matter what happened. A player familiar with ideal strategy would be inclined to call this all-in with almost any two cards. However, not all players understand this concept and how it is profitable to call all-ins, in such spots.

                            Please understand that we are not offering excuses, just possibilities to complement the facts of our detailed investigation. Yes, it is true that these reasons may seem like rare or wild occurrences but they are very common in an online environment happening multiple times a day on any poker site.

                            Given the lack of any relationship between their accounts, the relatively rare play together, and the lack of any suspiciously played hands, there is no evidence to suggest these two players are cooperating at our tables.

                            I have placed notes in both players' accounts indicating your concerns and the result of this review.

                            Once again, thank you for your report, and for choosing PokerStars.


                            PokerStars Game Security Team
                            3 Time Bracelet Winner


                            • #15
                              a big lol at that response



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